Minutes to the Fifth Meeting of the

Accessible Transportation Standards Development Committee (T-SDC)

Canadian Standards Association
5060 Spectrum Way
Mississauga ON

June 22 - 23, 2006

As amended to incorporate comments received.

Members Present:

• Al Cormier, Cor Al Services, Chair
• George Ansell, Ministry of Northern Development and Mines
• Spiros Bastas, Royal Taxi (represented by Eva Karavas)
• Jo-Ann Bentley, Canadian Hearing Society
• James Bisson, Association of Municipal Managers, Clerks and Treasurers of Ontario/City of Mississauga
• Earl Black, Independent Living Resource Centre
• Mark Brose, Transportation Action Now
• Silvan Bruno, GO Transit
• Tony Carnovale, Community Living Ontario
• Katrina Carrera, Association des municipalités Francophones de l'Ontario
• David Carroll, Ontario Motor Coach Association and School Bus Association
• Sandy Chan, Ministry of Education (represented by Vanissa Szeto)
• Alex Grant, HAGI Community Services for Independence
• Sharon Hambleton, Ontario Federation of Labour (represented by Duncan MacDonald June 23 only)
• Blyth Helman, Ottawa-Carleton District School Board
• Glenn Johnston, Toronto Transit Commission
• Kim Lambert, Ministry of Transportation (represented by Rob Barnes)
• Caroline Lonsdale, Ministry of Health and Long-Term Care
• Lesley Anne MacDonald, Canadian National Institute for the Blind
• Alex Milojevic, Assocation of Municipalties of Ontario, City of Brampton, member of OCTA/CUTA
• Tim Nolan, Council of Ontario Universities
• Kelly Palecnzy, Ontario Community Transportation Association
• Lloyd Pollock, Dignity Transportation Incorporated (represented by Jeff Pasoff)
• Danielle Svec, Life Skills Institute (Bloorview Kids Rehab)
• Valmay Barkey, Ontario Community Support Association
• Tanya Wanio, Ministry of Municipal Affairs and Housing

Absent Members:

• Susan Enid Mintz, The Kidney Foundation of Canada

Support Unit:

• Nancy Bestic, Canadian Standards Association
• Kevin Boehmer, Canadian Standards Association
• Bob Sherman, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario
• Mike Dodd, Canadian Standards Association, Transportation SDC Secretary
• Mansur Rahim, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario Liaison
• Jill Sawchuk, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario
• Michael Sullivan, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario
• Nelly Tion, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario
• Scot Weeres, Accessibility Directorate of Ontario

M5.1 Call to Order
M. Dodd, project manager at Canadian Standards Association, called the meeting to order at 9:30 a.m. on June 22.

M5.2 Housekeeping and Facility Safety
M. Dodd advised members of the housekeeping issues and facility safety procedures for the meeting.

M5.3 Opening Remarks and Membership Introductions
A. Cormier welcomed everyone to the meeting. A. Cormier noted the work of the committee and outlined the direction and goals for the fifth meeting of the Transportation Standards Development Committee (T-SDC).

M5.4 Approval of the Agenda
A. Cormier noted that the ADO had been researching the size of mobility aids available in the marketplace. This item would be discussed under new business.

M5.5 Minutes to the Last Meeting
M. Dodd reported that minutes to Meeting 4, held on May 29 and 30, 2006, had been reviewed by the members, editorial comments had been received, and incorporated. The revised minutes had been submitted to the ADO for posting to the website.

L. A. MacDonald commented that the minutes to Meeting 3 did not reflect that the T-SDC decided not to consider subway platforms. It was noted that this item was referred to the ADO for submission to a future built environment committee.

S. Bruno pointed out that the OCTA/CUTA letter dated April 18, 2006 had not been included in Meeting 3 minutes and posted on the ADO website. It was agreed that the letter would be incorporated into the Meeting 3 minutes and posted.

A. Cormier pointed out that the acceptance of the minutes by the committee, in accordance with the committee’s terms of reference was confusing. He suggested that starting with this meeting the minutes should be sent out for review by the members. Written comments are to be submitted to CSA and the comments would be reported and considered at the following meeting of the committee. Minutes would be approved by the SDC at the following meeting.

M5.6 Membership
The membership of the T-SDC was reviewed. It was noted that for this meeting, L. Pollack would be represented by J. Pasoff, S. Bastas would be represented by E. Karavas and S. Hambleton would be represented by D. MacDonald.

M5.7 Action Items from the Last Meeting
M. Dodd reported that Action M4.10.2 had been submitted by C. Lonsdale and the suggested changes had been incorporated in Clauses 8 and 9 and that any discussion of this item would be recorded under M5.9.

J. Bisson reported on initial information from a survey on the municipal readiness for accessible taxi standards. His draft report was handed out at the meeting.

M5.8 Scope issues for consideration by other Standards Development Committees
It was noted that lists of items the T-SDC felt should be considered by the Customer Service, Built Environment and Information Communication committees had been prepared. The list of items that the T-SDC felt were customer service issues had been submitted to the Customer Service committee. J. Sandys, chair of the CS-SDC, sent a letter in response to the suggestions by the T-SDC. J. Sandys suggested that the CS-SDC had considered the issues and had wording in their draft that would address the various issues.

A copy of the latest Customer Service draft was sent by e-mail to the T-SDC for review.

M5.9 Work in Progress / Task Force Reports
A clause-by-clause discussion of the draft proposed standard was held with
K. Boehmer leading the discussion on Clauses 1, 2, 3, and 4;
K. Paleczny leading the discussion on Clause 5;
D. Svec leading the discussion on Clause 6; and
K. Boehmer leading the discussion on Clauses 7, 8, and 9.

Comments were recorded and incorporated into Draft 4.

T. Wanio noted that the on-demand service task force will have to re-consider its proposal, so that the Standard speak directly to the industry rather than using the municipalities as intermediaries.

The Support Unit noted that there seems to be no uniform understanding of the meaning of the universally used accessibility symbol. It was agreed that it would be researched and reported at the next meeting.

L. A. MacDonald noted that the CNIB wants all stops announced and they want the route announced both visually and audibly before the passenger boards the conveyance.

J. Pasoff, on behalf of the Canadian Taxicab Association (CTA), reported on concerns and recommendations pertaining to the provision of accessible taxis. The report from the CTA was provided to SDC members for their consideration.

Remaining issues to be worked on by:

The following chart shows the schedule for revisions:

The following chart shows the task forces that will review specific sections of the draft for proposed implementation schedule:

M5.9.1 Signage

T. Nolan and L.A. MacDonald presented a proposal regarding signage. It was agreed that the proposal would be refined with the Support Unit and sent to the T-SDC prior to the next meeting.

M5.10 Readiness and Costing Assessments
A presentation was made by consultants from Deloitte and ENTRA on preliminary readiness and costing analysis. The consultants reported that workshops would be held on the morning of June 29 and the afternoon of July 6. The members were left with a copy of the presentation and the report from Deloitte/ENTRA. The T-SDC members were asked to review the information and to submit any comments by July 14 to R. Bucci at rbucci@deloitte.ca.

Given that the initial draft only provided a cost for implementing in 2006. C. Lonsdale asked for costs for each timeframe (2010 vs. 2015 vs. 2020 vs. 2025) to be included in the consultants' report so that T-SDC can reach an evidence-based decision on the cost benefit of implementing these standards in particular years. R. Bucci promised to discuss that with the ADO.

M5.11 Governance
It was suggested at the last meeting that the issue of governance (e.g., advisory councils) be addressed in the draft initial proposed standard. The ADO considered the appropriateness of putting governance in the draft and reported back that the issue of governance was not contemplated under the AODA.

T. Nolan and others suggested that a governance recommendation be forwarded to the minister with the final proposed standard.

M5.12 Review/Update of the T-SDC Work Plan

M5.13 New Business

M5.13.1 Wheelchair Dimensions
The ADO reported that they were in the process of securing a consultant to gathering information pertaining to wheelchair dimensions and their application to the conveyances under the T-SDC scope, and would be prepared to share information at a future meeting.

M5.14 Next Meeting

M5.14.1 Meeting 6
Meeting 6 of the T-SDC is scheduled for

Date: July 24 and 25, 2006
Place: Canadian Standards Association
Address: 5060 Spectrum Way
Mississauga ON L4W 5N6

Time: 9:30 a.m. – 5:00 p.m. on July 24, 2006
9:30 a.m. – 4:00 p.m. on July 25, 2006

M5.14.2 Meeting 7
Meeting 7 of the T-SDC is scheduled for

Date: August 28 and 29, 2006
Place: Canadian Standards Association
Address: 5060 Spectrum Way
Mississauga ON L4W 5N6

Time: 9:30 a.m. – 5:00 p.m. on August 28, 2006
9:30 a.m. – 4:00 p.m. on August 29, 2006

M5.15 Adjournment
The meeting adjourned at 3:25 p.m. on June 23, 2006.

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